Brexit petition

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215

Well if you didn't want to come out perhaps this might help

Interesting article: https://www.google.com/amp/mobile.nytimes.com/2016/06/26/opinion/tony-blair-brexits-stunning-coup.amp.html

Well in my opinion I could honestly see not other outcome than the UK leaving the EU. With all the lies and untrue figures spouted by the BrExit camp the Xenophobic Brits were in their element and the insults and threats to EU nationals has already started, with ''Poles Go Home'' scrawled on streets and notes put through letterboxes.
I'm glad I live in Italy, but I worry for our children and Grandchildren who now have to grow up in a climate of hate, fear and uncertainty. 
As the old adage goes, 'Be careful what you wish for'.

There could be some hope. Both Scotland and Northern Ireland could exercise their veto rights... Or at least this could force a new referendum...
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/scotland-considers-flexing-veto-muscle-in-brexit-vote/
I agree, Flip, the ones who would suffer the consequences are the younger generations.

I think there is some hope - in my opinion only of course, Nicola Sturgeon seems to be the most positive and strong politician re this so far and she is adamant to do all she can to look after Scotland's future interests which are to remain within the EU. This may well result with all the SNP MPs vetoing leaving the EU. If this happens and there is another referendum I think a lot of 'leave' voters will change their minds - the 3million plus petition signees would reverse the present result surely?

And yo top it all http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-disenfranchised-expats-denied-eu-referendum-missing-postal-votes-demand-re-run-hundreds-a7103066.html

Well here I am!  A minority of one on this forum as usual.

I'm one of the 52% who voted Brexit.  Why?  Mainly because I can't stand any longer being dictated to by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels and partly because I don't believe in the long term viability of a proposed 'United States of Europe'.

I fully accept that the next few months, perhaps even years, will be economically and politically difficult but we were Great Britain before the EU and we will surely become 'Great' again. 

Agree with you Ghiro, I would have voted the same way against the arrogance of the EU and their overpaid and pathetic leaders.

Oh well, Ghiro and Geo, you are entitled to have your own opinions... But look at the facts https://fullfact.org/europe/does-brussels-influence-70-uk-law/
And this issue has been grossly manipulated.
Also, I do believe that all EU members ELECT their EU Representatives in the EU Parliament....
Ghiro, the Roman and the Spanish Empires were larger and glorious once upon the time... We cannot live in the past. The world is constantly changing and globalization is real. 
Oh... BY the way, Spain may get back Gibraltar... After all, they want to remain in the EU. And what are you going to do about Scotland and Northern Ireland? PErhaps all what has been achieved is to create the new Divided Kingdom... Not a recipe for "greatness", I'm afraid ...

Thank you GP.  Helpful and informative as ever.  Very useful when you're unedukated like I is.

Gala Placidia wrote:............ Oh... BY the way, Spain may get back Gibraltar... After all, they want to remain in the EU. ...........

Never in a million years - If I remember correctly, they voted a few years ago about joining Spain - not sure anyone voted Yes.



I think they'd 'rather stick pins in their eyes' than become part of Spain.  There is more chance of Scotland joining the EU  - and that's pretty close to Zero

Well, Alan, things do change and in this referendum Gibraltarians voted to Remain. Also, if you look at his Demographics of Gibraltar I have doubts about their allegiances to the UK after this Brexit...
Did you know that all the well off Gibraltarians own property in the South of Spain? Particularly in the posh enclave called Sotogrande... Quite funny!!!

ghiro wrote:Well here I am!  A minority of one on this forum as usual. :(I'm one of the 52% who voted Brexit.  Why?  Mainly because I can't stand any longer being dictated to by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels and partly because I don't believe in the long term viability of a proposed 'United States of Europe'.I fully accept that the next few months, perhaps even years, will be economically and politically difficult but we were Great Britain before the EU and we will surely become 'Great' again. 

A few facts for you Ghiro:-
Those unelected Bureaucrats compose of Elected MEPs.
The main reason GB as you say was Great it was because of Imperialism and colonisation of Foreign Lands which gave those inhabitants the right of entry to GB, now you get a sense of how India, Jamaica and countless other Countries felt.
Most of the legislation coming from the EU has been beneficial to the UK, unless you prefer filthy beaches, no workers rights, dangerous goods, safety in the home etc etc. in fact there are only something like 4 or 5 EU laws past last year that directly affect the UK, most were to do with Safety legislation.
If you believe outright lies by spread around by your Politicians (£350 million a week to the EU for example) and are stupid enough to believe that the UK will continue on benefitting from free trade with Europe with no free movement of people, then it's about time those Rose Tints on your glasses were changed.
If, God forbid, the UK does leave the EU, which is thankfully looking less likely, then look forward to TTIP as that will be your only trade agreement to look forward to and you can wave a fond farewell to the NHS as you know it and prepare to pay for all your treatment.
This vote fell into the arms of ***********, with tunnel vision so acute, they were prepared to cut of their nose to spite their face. I have open hatred to people so small minded that use the phrase ''Take our Country Back'' and ''Lets make Britain Great again''. My Children who live and were born in the UK carry Italian Surnames and they have said that they are receiving hostility at work from some Racist scum, so Ghiro if you wish to be dictated to ***********, you have voted correctly.
I don't believe the EU works perfectly, far from it but to act like children and take your ball back because you're loosing, is not the way to effect change, working within is the only way.

I know this is an emotive issue and I welcome differing opinions but I will not stand for insults against either side.

I will edit posts that use that kind of language.

Flip wrote:
I don't believe the EU works perfectly, far from it but to act like children and take your ball back because you're loosing, is not the way to effect change, working within is the only way.

I totally agree. The EU can be improved, nothing is perfect, but you can only do it if you belong to it. 
We can only hope that all these petitions will work and sanity will return.

Thank you Flip for your contribution (and thank you also Admin for your intervention).

True Flip that MEPs are elected.  However, unlike the UK Parliament, they are unable to propose legislation in the EU.  Only the European Commission can do this - and NONE of them is elected.

http://europa.eu/about-eu/institutions-bodies/european-parliament/index_en.htm
Sorry Ghiro, but you are misinformed about the role of the EU Parliament.
And here is the role of the Commission http://europa.eu/about-eu/institutions-bodies/european-commission/index_en.htm

Oops! Forgot about the Council http://europa.eu/about-eu/institutions-bodies/council-eu/index_en.htm

Thank you for agreeing with me GP. 

As the links you kindly provide show NEITHER the members of the EU Commission nor the EU Council are ELECTED and only the EU Commission can propose legislation.

GHiro, please read again the roles and composition of the 3 bodies. The Parliament, which is the one elected by all of us, is the true legislative power. The other two make proposals or oversee the execution and abidance of the laws sanctioned by the Parliament. The Council is made up by government ministers representing each country and governments which have been, in turn, elected.bthe Commission is not elected, but they also are representatives of elected governments from member countries. So basically, they all are either directly or indirectly elected.
Perhaps we should have has this discussion prior to the referendum. It looks as if there has been lots of deliberate misinformation.

I like the concept of 'indiirectly elected'.    Sometimes I think you're making this up as you go along GP!  

Are the EU Commission elected? No! FACT!

Are the EU Council elected? No! FACT!

Are the European Parliament elected? Yes! FACT!

Are the unelected EU Commission the only body who can propose legislation?  Yes!  FACT!

Agreed it would have been helpful to have had this discussion back in the day.  But the reality is, whether you like it or not, that the majority of people who voted want to leave the EU.  FACT!

But you do elect the governments who appoint those ministers or members. Don't you? So you are indirectly electing them... Of course, you may have voted for another party, but it is still your elected government.
Can you really call a 4 points difference a true majority? Take away all those who did not know what they were really voting for, the ones who are already regretting the way they voted, those who were unable to vote against their will...
And those are FACTS.
Never mind, Ghiro, it is your decision...

I've had a brilliant idea GP!  Let's agree to disagree.  That way the other members of this fine forum don't have to listen to us bickering!

Agreed!!!

On the other hand GP perhaps we should start bickering again.  There's not a lot otherwise going on here!